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Racism vs. Colourism

Discussion in 'K-POP' started by chickseli, Jul 22, 2018.

  1. chickseli

    chickseli Newbie

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    Since last week there have been multiple threads regarding Park Jimin’s of BTS use of the Korean word Kkhamdoongie in 2015. A video was pulled from depths of the internet, to show that Jimin is a stark raving mad racist that needs to be canceled! I don’t see how he can be canceled when I don’t get to cancel Donald Trump. He’s still President. Anyway, I digress. What I’m trying to say is…..

    Park Jimin is not a racist. Point. Blank.






    I’ve said this multiple times and I'll say it again, Kkhamdoong/Kkahmdoongie is a context word. That means the meaning changes depending on the sentence and situation. And yes, Ni**er is a context word too. It just a word I choose not use.

    Different dictionaries have more or less the same meanings for it, but what it basically boils down to is:
    Kkhamdoong/Kkahmdoongie
    1. Dark-faced person
    2. A negro, a colored man, a nigger, a darky, a blackie, a blacky
    3. A black dog
    4. A black person or African American

    After watching the video, honestly which definition do you think Jimin was using? Judging by JK’s response which definition do you think Jimin was using? Jimin wasn’t being spiteful or hurt trying to hurt JK. Sadly, what he did do was show colorist tendencies.

    Colourism/Colorist is the discrimination or prejudice against individuals with a dark skin tone, typically among people of the same ethnic group.


    And if you were still confused or in doubt, KNetz should have cleared up the difference with their responses to the Whiz Khalifa controversy. These responses were from some very angry and hurt people.

    Source: Herald Pop via Nate

    1. [+1,827, -20] This ba$tard even came to Korea to put on concerts. Love how he's like "I love Korea♥" when he's making money off of us but racist behind our backs. I always assumed the hip hop artists in America weren't this cowardly but I guess I was wrong ㅋㅋㅋ

    2. [+1,804, -30] Go eat dirt cookies, you n*gger


    3. [+1,685, -20] Well now he's going to get called kkamdoongie (derogatory term for black people)

    4. [+61, -2] Black people don't like Koreans because they're jealous. In the short history of immigration, Koreans were able to set up a foundation and send their kids off to college and land them jobs as doctors and lawyers... while black people are still at the bottom despite being one of the dominant races in America.

    5. [+53, -3] There are tons of kids in Korea with bigger eyes than him

    6. [+39, -4] Shut up, kkanmdoong-ah!

    7. [+38, -1] Out of all the Asians, why'd he have to specify Korean? Pisses me off!!

    8. [+32, -1] When we used to call black people "heuk hyung" as a term of endearment, we still stopped when they told us it made them uncomfortable. And what do we get back in return? "I have Korean friends who don't find the lyrics uncomfortable"? Well if I have a friend who has no problem saying "negro", can I use that word too?

    9. [+22, -1] Don't really care to listen to what this kkamdoongie ba$tard has to say

    10. [+14, -0] Kkamdoongies get all up in arms over racism against them but they treat Asians like we're toys ㅋㅋ


    To be fair Whiz Khalifa fucked up. He did and said something that he would probably be offended about if someone did it to him. Plus he pulled the "I have [insert ethnic group here] friends ..... card. Dumbass.

    I did take issue with Jimin’s statement, but not because I thought it was racist. I took issue because it reminded me of the colorist issues South Korea (and a good part of Asia) has.

    South Korea has this ideal type or standard of beauty that includes pale skin. When you first notice this societal preference, you would think it something to do with the beauty standards of the dominant ethnic group in Western society. You would be wrong. This preference harkens back to days long past and was more of a classism issue then. If your skin is pale you were rich and able to stay indoors all day. If your skin was tan, you were poor and worked outside. Succinctly, Pale was rich/beautiful, and Tan was poor/ugly. Modern times have condensed it to Pale is beautiful, and tan is ugly

    You can see how this affects idols by their constant comments about getting tanned/dark. Wearing makeup 2 to 3 shades too light for their skin tone. Fully covering their arms, legs, and faces when out in the sun during the summer or while on vacation. A when you see stuff like this happening you tend to ask yourself, ‘Are they even having fun?’ ‘Aren’t they hot?’ Probably, but the fact that it is something that they worry about is saddening.

    For tangible examples, I’ll point to whitewashing by fans and print media and makeup, lack of diverse foundation shades (SK skin tones does not consist of 3 pale colors). These things are tangible and being KPop fans, something we see or are interested in every day.

    One of the YouTubers I follow is Kennie JD and she talks a lot about Korean culture, K Beauty, and sometimes KPop (she likes RM). Some of her “fans” took offense to some of her comments in a video title Black Girl Tries Korean Makeup. So, she made a video explaining why she made the comments and explains it better than I ever could.


    The story about her Korean interviewer not being able to buy a foundation at the stores and had to go to Itaewon to find darker shades.

    SideNote – If you don’t follow her, you should. Her videos are informative, helpful, and a lot of times hilarious. StoryTime is the best!

    One thing I do want to point to out is that racism and colorism is SLOWLY but surely fading out South Korean Society. As most people know, things like this take A LOT of time, but you will eventually get there.


    Sorry for the long post, but someone told me I should be ashamed for not thinking Jimin was a racist. I was told I had low self-esteem and questioned as to whether I “paint my face another color and put weave on”. These comments didn’t hurt me, I just found them interesting as someone is trying to tell me how I should feel about the non-situation. This is called manufactured/fake wokeness. It’s manufactured or fake because they don’t actually care how these statements affect black people (or any other dark person and/or ethnicity). They just want to attack someone they don’t like and to them, it’s a good reason. They are basically using a cause for their hate.

    All of this is not to say I don't call out racism. I do, but only when it's actually racism and not ignorance.


    Just to clear up where I'm coming from with this, I’m a Black American woman. The thing with me is I don’t ‘look” black. I’ve been questioned about my ethnicity for as long as I can remember. I get questions like, “Are you mixed?” No. “Do you speak Spanish?” No. “Are you from the Middle East?” No. “Is that your hair?” Yes. “Did you buy it?” No. “Can I touch your hair?” No. You get the point. I am the lightest person in my family and I’ve seen it firsthand.

    As someone that has experienced colourism, I can tell you in some ways it can be worse than racism. Because it’s normally coming from your own “people”. Don’t get me wrong, there are races or ethnic groups that practice colorism against other races. But coming from someone that you would normally have a connection with is disheartening and somewhat painful.

    @Nebula_Star
     
    #1 chickseli, Jul 22, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2018
  2. ListenToBadMusic

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    There is a lot of stereotyping and derogatory words used, but I wouldn't say that everyone like straight up hates other races.

    However, despite you know it'd be a big deal if a famous white person here got tan and said they looked hella black or something. People would 100% be outraged, even though the person isn't racist.
     
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  3. Leean_Taeyong

    Leean_Taeyong Celebrity

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    LOOOOOOOOL

    Fake woke bullshit at it’s finest.
     
  4. chickseli

    chickseli Newbie

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    Good point. But I'm too old for that bullshit. Some people just like to be extra and call everything racism.
     
  5. Kongming

    Kongming Newbie

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    I guess I'm racist too because what's how I called black people growing up. Even my parents used the word so we're just one racist family.

    Koreans don't say the word because it means "nigger". I dont say it anymore because there's a better word choice for it like "heuk in".
     
  6. PringleGoddess

    PringleGoddess Trainee

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    Tan skin being "ugly" is an asian issue more than anything. In the west tan is considered beautiful and desirable. Guys go crazy over latina/asian women and white girls tan to the point where it's unhealthy. I'm not black and I don't know what goes on in black communities but I don't think i've ever heard anyone mocked for having tan skin in America. Maybe it's just an issue between your people?
     
  7. G_S00

    G_S00 Rookie

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    Stop bringing this up
     
  8. Karla

    Karla Rookie

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    Why?
     
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  9. Karla

    Karla Rookie

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    It disgusts me that that comment calling Wiz Khalifa the N word on Nate has got over 1000 pluses... I assume that is people voting? They are offended by Wiz Khalifa and his lyric but they express or support racism

    Wiz Khalifa’s lyric was offensive and should be criticised but calling him the N word is terrible!
     
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  10. botmy

    botmy Public Figure

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    I read somewhere that colorist jokes are used on your own race.
    Imo, colorism isnt as bad as racism, but sometimes it depends.
    People really went lookin for that lol
    Im glad that sk is finally starting to get rid of that beauty standard
     
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  11. LucasIsZaddy

    LucasIsZaddy Trainee

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    I can't even cancel him because I was never checking for him. Sucks for his black fans that were offended.
     
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  12. SleepingGiant

    SleepingGiant Trainee

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    The whole Lighter skin is Beautiful has always been a Class thing not a Race thing

    People who worked the fields would have rough hands and darker skin being in the sun all day

    The Aristocracy would have lighter skin and smoother skin not having to toil in the fields

    That Lifestyle was of course envied by the Poor not only Eastern Asia but literally every Culture in History

    We know the Japanese had this standard Long before White Man ever showed up there, the Parasol for keeping Sunlight (not rain) of skin was a thing for Centuries before White Man contacted Japan in-fact EVERY society in History had this standard because Hundreds of Years ago it was consistent across the board

    The Poor worked long hours in the Sun, and the Rich lived a Lavish lifestyle in their Mansions

    It is no co-incidence that this perception has changed with the advent of Industrialism and the Worker now toils in Offices and Factory floors out of the Suns light, to now in the Western World being more lighter than Normal is seen as unhealthy, it is seen almost as Poor
     
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  13. Sorrybae39

    Sorrybae39 Rookie

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    Generally Asians like fairer skin.This preference has absolutely no relation to Black American history.
    So if an East Asian casually asks a friend back from a holiday why she's looking so dark or tanned, it doesn't imply she's calling her friend a Black person.

    Different cultures have their own beauty standards. Some African tribes like women to have very long necks, some like their women to be very fat and in the past, China likes women to have small feet. Why try to impose your own cultural thinking on others. Not every thing has a reference to Black American History.
     
    #13 Sorrybae39, Jul 23, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2018
  14. jojomomo

    jojomomo Rookie

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    I'll echo what others have pointed out. Korea and other Asian countries' aesthetic preference for paler skin has nothing to do with white or black people at all. Paler skin has been a symbol of higher social status for thousands of years.

    "Colorism" isn't just for Asians. British people's obsession with tanned skin is probably even more than Koreans' with pale skin. There is a show called Love Island where they put a bunch of strangers together to match them up. All the white girls look so dark. All the white guys too, except this one poor guy whose skin just wouldn't tan. He's the tallest, very good looking, a doctor, and no girls want to pick him. The show totally exemplifies how much the Brit society sees tanned skin as mainstream beauty. But this preference also has nothing to do with black people, it's not an indication that Brits love the black race.
     
  15. Fatosh

    Fatosh Rookie

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    Also can we like stop trying to translate the american word"n*gger" that is loaded with context into other languages? Thats not how languages work.
     
  16. chickseli

    chickseli Newbie

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    Colourism in the black community pretty much has the same connotations in the community as it does in Asian countries. During slavery having lighter skin meant that you worked in the house and not in the fields, that was obviously an advantage. After slavery it was seen as a plus because you could possibly pass for white or were safer, again an advantage. Or even experience less racism and were "higher class". Story, my grandparents are from Louisiana. Myself and aunt went with them to visit family. One night my aunt asked me to go restaurant with her to order a crawfish boil. We get to the restaurant and my aunt starts ordering. Now mind you I'm standing behind and off to the side my aunt not saying a word. When this cashier had questions, she kept looking past my aunt and directing her questions to me. Why? I want ordering. I want even talking. My aunt had to redirect this womans attention by literally snapping on her. That's colorism.

    Why? It seems someone brings this up every other month.

    I can't speak for all black people, but obviously I wasn't offended.

    I know that. My point was to explain his comments and why they weren't seen as racist.
     
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  17. bbyseoul

    bbyseoul Newbie

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    [QUOTE="chickseli, post: 3297526, member: 102079"]Colourism in the black community pretty much has the same connotations in the community as it does in Asian countries. During slavery having lighter skin meant that you worked in the house and not in the fields, that was obviously an advantage. After slavery it was seen as a plus because you could possibly pass for white or were safer, again an advantage. Or even experience less racism and were "higher class". Story, my grandparents are from Louisiana. Myself and aunt went with them to visit family. One night my aunt asked me to go restaurant with her to order a crawfish boil. We get to the restaurant and my aunt starts ordering. Now mind you I'm standing behind and off to the side my aunt not saying a word. When this cashier had questions, she kept looking past my aunt and directing her questions to me. Why? I want ordering. I want even talking. My aunt had to redirect this womans attention by literally snapping on her. That's colorism.



    Why? It seems someone brings this up every other month.





    I can't speak for all black people, but obviously I wasn't offended.



    I know that. My point was to explain his comments and why they weren't seen as racist.[/QUOTE]

    I would specify what community in general, not really the black community because colorism isn’t a thing in many black African countries.
     
  18. chickseli

    chickseli Newbie

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    I would specify what community in general, not really the black community because colorism isn’t a thing in many black African countries.[/QUOTE]

    In Black American communities.

    I also want to point out that experienced something similar, but more in the way of comments when I worked Hyderabad, India.
     
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  19. G_S00

    G_S00 Rookie

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    Nevermind The thread didn't load in properly so i didn't see anything
     
  20. twinklingtwinkly

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    You are such a QUEEN
    Thank you for stating the facts we all need.
     
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